Diana Cage & Prof C: Gender & Sexuality Part Six

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Diana Cage & Prof C: Gender & Sexuality Part Six

 

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Comments [44]

Lezbeth's picture

Cage and Prof C, I keep

Cage and Prof C, I keep seeing this great picture of the two of you when I go to VP homepage and can't help but notice...the clothes are matching again. Cute...probably not intentional though, right?

Not2Taem's picture

"enough time for the ugly to

"enough time for the ugly to come out"

Katie, I love you ho nails and all! Laughing out loud

Not2Taem's picture

CAMW, have you been dating

CAMW, have you been dating Jenny's again? I thought we talked about how unhealthy that is.

Wink

Not2Taem's picture

Aww Steph, you really know

Aww Steph, you really know how to make a gal feel appreciated.
<3
Tae

btfan2's picture

CA I'm not talking about

CA

I'm not talking about Blatant lairs such as Bush and friends. I believe most people are not Blatant liars. But; I have come to realize very recently that lying is so necessary to survive in the world today. Most likely always has been.

You can't tell me that if a young girl you work with excitably shows you her brand new engagement ring while everyone goes on and on about how beautiful it is. That you are going to say geeze that's one ugly ring. Your going to lie and say something positive or say nothing - the lie of omission.

We travel from the beginning of our day to the end telling little white lies, lies of omission political lies of survival and go along get along friend, co-worker, and relationship lies.

We sit in meetings and say nothing, rather then speak the truth as we see it because the truth has gotten us burned in the past and it's a harsh lesson. Again lies of omission.

If we don't we will have pretty long and tortured days. We have friends that we have unspoken packs with so we can sit and be HONEST, without the bullshit, guilt and hassle of exposing how we really feel to that harsh, judgmental world that controls way to much of our existence.

I been told many times that I am brutally honest. It has never been said as a compliment. It's a no win. If your honest you get beaten up and if your political you have to live with your own reduced self respect. Most people juggle this without much concern some of us don't.

I used to be pretty proud of being an honest person. But; even that was a lie. I am no more honest or dishonest then any other person when I'm brave enough to be really honest with myself.

I do know and this is just a personal thing I'd feel pretty shitty if that senior driver lost his job. Especially if I hadn't taken the time and energy to find out why he lied and why "he felt he had to". Again just a personal thing.

Steph H's picture

You ROCK Tae... thanks for

You ROCK Tae... thanks for making me smile such a big smile at the start of my working week! Wink xx

CA_Medicine_Woman's picture

Lies sweep things under the

Lies sweep things under the rug, until one day when you end up tripping on it.

Wow, I like that one!

CA_Medicine_Woman's picture

Yeah, the story behind the

Yeah, the story behind the tattoos would be interesting! I've always had a fascination about tattoos, though I have none myself.

mysticsmb's picture

The real lying is the lies we

The real lying is the lies we tell ourselves...

Like CA Medicine Woman I'm a crappy liar (most Aries are--being the youngest sign we're 'kids' when it comes to lying), so I don't do it too often. We can convince ourselves that we're doing it for some other person's benefit (little white lies), but usually it's because we can't handle the truth, not the other person. And eventually the truth usually comes out, like 10 years later when you're sitting in therapy with your girlfriend and saying you've always hated those damn curtains.

Lies sweep things under the rug, until one day when you end up tripping on it.

minniesota's picture

Lying is my favorite sin.

Lying is my favorite sin. That's the truth. Wink

Still searching for the right brainy quote.

CA_Medicine_Woman's picture

While I'll readily admit that

While I'll readily admit that I have never met anyone who has never told a lie, I'm not so cynical (yet) as to believe that everyone lies all the time. There are honest people in this world, some like me who are brutally honest. It isn't so much that we are insensitive or cold hearted, we just suck so badly at lying that telling the truth has far fewer immediate and no long term consequences.

It really sucks, especially when trying to calm an accident victim, spare someone's feelings on an issue I want no part of to begin with, when a child asks if Santa is real, etc. Besides, if you tell one lie, you have to tell more to support the first one, more to support those, etc. It's too much fiction to have to keep straight in my head, and reality has a way of exposing lies at the most inconvenient of times. As such, I've become quite adept at avoiding situations where lying might be a more appropriate way to go to begin with.

One thing I do have is the uncanny ability to spot a lie. Last week, we had a driver blow six tires at once. He lied about how it happened, and I picked up on certain "tells" instantly. Then I inspected the tires and his rig, and the evidence didn't come close to his version of events. He knows I didn't believe him, and he knows I reported my assessment of what happened. Had he told the truth to begin with, I probably wouldn't have become involved in the incident to begin with, other than to bring him the replacement tires. But he didn't, he chose to lie instead. The lies, not the accident, will be the reason this senior driver with the company is let go later this week.

Such is life, I guess.

btfan2's picture

Something that no one has

Something that no one has mentioned concerning communications. Lying!! Lying is so pervasive in the world society and yet it is never acknowledged as a vital part of communications.

Good bad or indifferent we all lie. We do it all day every day. Morning to night. I'm convinced that once humans developed a vocal cord and began the long journey to the "information age", the first grunts, groans, squawks and attempts at language were mostly lies.

The head of the clan asked the empty handed hunter if he saw any prey and got a no, grunt. While the hapless hunter most likely saw something threw a rock and missed or whatever. But; before he would admit failure to the clan or his mate he most likely lied.

We started out as liars and have honed the skill into one of the if not the most important ingredients for success in any number of areas; work, relationships, friendships, politics(no kidding), religion(yep), etc,etc.

I learned in my very early teen years that if a girl asked you if you liked her new hair do, skirt, sweater pick one; she absolutely DID NOT want the truth in any form.

My boss sure as shit doesn't want the truth when he asks what I think of his new proposal to the board. Believe me he doesn't.

My partner doesn't need the truth when she asked me if I like the new curtains, because first I love her and second I just don't need the hassle.

We all lie to everyone about everything, because we live in society and have no choice. The reason children have a hard time before they get IT, is they are to honest.

Everyone says they hate liars, that's a lie. We abhor honesty. We go to unbelievable lengths to not acknowledge the elephant in the room no mater how large or how destructive. We tell complicated ingenious lies to avoid hurting someones feeling, or exposing our own. We lie constantly, consistently on every level and never acknowledge our deceit even to ourselves. Humans just can't handle the truth. Otherwise lying wouldn't, be such an essential skill.

I love the people who say they don't lie. I smile to myself and think liar.

If you think it through how well you do in life is directly tied to how well you lie. Relationships don't get me started.....

laur laur's picture

butches are from mars, femmes

butches are from mars, femmes are from venus!

Not2Taem's picture

I don't think you'll find

I don't think you'll find many arguments on that one here.

Let's all take time out to appreciate breasts today. Wrap your fingers around some firm little hillocks or major mounds and let them know that you truly appreciate their nurturing strength. You might even want to give them a little kiss or... Well, I'm sure you get the idea.

Hope you all have a sumptuous Sunday and Mammary Monday!
Wink

Steph H's picture

I agree with every word you

I agree with every word you say, but I am not going to get started either as I want to enjoy the rest of my sunday! One thing I will say though is that, in my view, women are, in many respects, the stronger sex.

Steph H's picture

That's the problem... :-(

That's the problem... Sad

LongBeachDogLover's picture

I agree Xanadu..... There is

I agree Xanadu.....

There is a plethora of derogatory terms to describe a woman who is strong, independent, self-assured, and confident. Whether it is a masculine gendered woman, or a more feminine gendered woman, there is an insulting word, or phrase, for all of us......

Odd, the blatant dichotomy here is that men are systematically described as being strong and in control.... regardless of how incompetent they may be..... Generally, they are afforded the privilege of being considered strong, and demanding of respect, simply because of their 'elevated status' as a male .....

*don't get me started*

Xanadu's picture

Off topic - but Diana and

Off topic - but Diana and Emma ...

Could you do a segment about all your tattoo's and the meaning behind them?

That would be interesting ... (and quite hot)

Xanadu's picture

Not to mention a 'Diva' ... I

Not to mention a 'Diva' ... I hate that term.

Conlite's picture

Good discussion Diana/Prof -

Good discussion Diana/Prof - I'm loving this series!

I think its both biology and choice that shape communication skills. They say boys and girls start out with different speech styles because of differences in the brain's speech centers. Despite this, there are both men and women who are good talkers, so education and choice must play a part too?

And now scientists say people may be gay/transgender because of biological brain differences. Would this affect our styles of communication?

My straight sister and I started out life with vastly different communication styles and abilities. Having gone through the same education and had similar life challenges, we are both good communicators, but we still have different ways of talking.

Not2Taem's picture

Nice pitch! :D

Nice pitch! Laughing out loud

Not2Taem's picture

"the strength behind breasts,

"the strength behind breasts, and what they represent"
I like that. Laughing out loud

diana cage's picture

Thank god someone is the

Thank god someone is the voice of reason here! LBDL I think you totally have a point on both counts.

LongBeachDogLover's picture

"But when a lady with bosoms

"But when a lady with bosoms does it, whether she is sporting a camisole or a tie or both, she is pushy, demanding, perhaps even a bitch."

Shit, that statement pisses me off. What a sad, but accurate, commentary on the state of humanity. I can't help but feel that a 'gentler' touch couldn't hurt ........look at our fucked up 'macho' world.

Aggression, brutal strength, and a lack of communicating certainly hasn't worked.

Why do we (collectively as people) correlate breasts with weakness? For God's sake, they are meant to give life, nourish the young and comfort. I find the strength behind breasts, and what they represent, to be incredibly awesome......

Wink

CA_Medicine_Woman's picture

Interesting point you brought

Interesting point you brought up, about having educational training and skills and having to be careful about how you use them.

I've had the communications classes (public, group, interpersonal), and more than a few psych classes. If I try to use what I've learned to solve a problem, I get accused of being manipulative. If I make an effort to not use these skills, I get accused of being manipulative by playing dumb. It's kind of a Catch 22 situation, either way I go I'm screwed.

Makes me glad I'm single, because I no longer have to walk that tightrope. Of course, it would help if those I had dated weren't trying out for the Jerry Springer Show, lol.

Not2Taem's picture

Especially among other women.

Especially among other women. Sad

CA_Medicine_Woman's picture

Yeah, kind of have to agree

Yeah, kind of have to agree with you on this one. I see it all the time at work, whether at our offices or at one of our customers, and I see these perceptions even amongst other women.

minniesota's picture

I will make this assertion:

I will make this assertion: Tomboys have no trouble communicating about the relationship but if you want to talk you must find us at the ball game. Wink

Still searching for the right brainy quote.

Katie Liederman's picture

okay a few things. 1. rusty,

okay a few things.
1. rusty, that first paragraph of yours makes me love you even harder.
2. diana, you need a manicure. perhaps consider press-on nails? i just bought a sweet gold set. i put them on all my nails besides the ones on my index and middle fingers. i know, i know: "ew." deal with it. this way, it looks like i'm either getting laid or a ho who has trouble following through on things, both of which are true (sort of). p.s. i love you.
3. emma, i hear what you're saying about this idea of masculine-gendered women communicating differently as being a fantasy, because it is, in some theoretical sense. but it's also a truth. one that you probably haven't been privy to because to the extent of my knowledge (and i could be wrong), you haven't been intimately involved with an extremely masculine woman for an extended period of time. enough time for the ugly stuff to come out. yes, sometimes they want to talk about it, and sometimes they want to talk about it at length, but i find that more often than not they just like to punch a hole in the wall and leave it at that (hot).

Idiot's picture

Yeah, I'd say that's true.

Yeah, I'd say that's true.

Not2Taem's picture

My only observation here is

My only observation here is that in relationships or outside of them, if you have tits, the world does not expect you to simple say what needs to be said. I guy can do this, and he is a strong leader. A beautiful, less bountifully endowed butch can do this and everyone will praise her for speaking up. But when a lady with bosoms does it, whether she is sporting a camisole or a tie or both, she is pushy, demanding, perhaps even a bitch.

Not2Taem's picture

Thanks Minnie. I was afraid

Thanks Minnie. I was afraid to say that, least I appear weak. Or horny. Or weak from excessive horniness. Wink

Rusty's picture

I can't speak for all butches

I can't speak for all butches but I have been told that my communication style is masculine because I tend to be a "fixer." Early in our relationship, if my ex-gf came home and complained about a sexist boss, my first instinct was to go to the EEOC website and start researching case law. 1/2 hour later I finally figured out that she just wanted to vent. After that, if she talked about a problem, I just asked her directly if she wanted my shoulder or my brain.

I have to admit that communication issues in relationships always made me feel just a little guilty because I taught interpersonal communication; if I applied what I knew I worried that I was taking unfair advantage.

(And faking a lack of communication skills to "get to the good stuff" is probably #42 on the list of compliance-gaining techniques.)

"When you look for the bad in mankind expecting to find it, you surely will." ~ Pollyanna

Idiot's picture

I'm a masculine woman and

I'm a masculine woman and sometimes have problems communicating. It's because what I want to say is considered wrong/not worthwhile/insane/horrible, and the person saying it (me) is also thought of that way (I don't live in a gay area). I've found this has also improved my communication skills a great deal in some ways. I'm better at being telling difficult truths, cutting through verbal nonsense, and communicating with others whose communication style is non-standard. Some of the problem is also that communication methods used in our society are nonsensical, and when I do make sense of them, I don't agree with them, so I don't do them.

Femme women I've known do communicate differently. Luckily they communicate better in the ways I suck at, so they've helped me. I think I've helped them also. I respect them for being able to do things that seem magic to me, like cry easily. So I've noticed a difference, and I'm glad of it.

LongBeachDogLover's picture

Beautifully said Lezbeth.....

Beautifully said Lezbeth..... thank you for being so honest.

Lezbeth's picture

Hmmm....good question. Yes,

Hmmm....good question. Yes, I think it was. I learned how to identify my feelings, own them and find ways of communicating without accusing. It's very hard to do. Vulnerability, I think, is powerful, not weak.

LongBeachDogLover's picture

Hi Lezbeth..... Was it

Hi Lezbeth.....

Was it therapy that helped you open up?

I'm glad that you understand the importance of being open, I think it displays our humanity.....not weakness. Smile

Lezbeth's picture

As a butch with many years of

As a butch with many years of therapy behind me, I have no problem opening my heart and communicating vulnerability. So far, in my relationships, communicating before problems arise rarely prevents them, it just lets both partners know what to expect in future arguments. Laughing out loud

LongBeachDogLover's picture

Diana...... Do you think

Diana......

Do you think that 'masculine gendered' women may find that opening up their hearts and communicating, could possibly make them appear to be 'weak' ? And as such, this could keep them from communicating as easily.....

Traditionally, in our society, more masculine individuals have a tendency to be reactionary in their relationships...... the communicating comes after problems arise.

Professor C.....

As you know, academia promotes communication, that is the basis of all learning..... Perhaps, this makes you an exception to the "atypical" masculine gendered lesbian ? Just a thought.

*my relationships have been femme on femme*

diana cage's picture

Oh man, this video is going

Oh man, this video is going to get me in trouble. I can feel it.

diana cage's picture

HAHHAAAAAA

HAHHAAAAAA

Erin Blackwell's picture

larvatus prodeo the origin of

larvatus prodeo
the origin of the tattoo please?

Lezbeth's picture

OK, I'll play along and try

OK, I'll play along and try out the premise. Obviously, this is a challenging issue to explore within a relationship. How about some personal observations, however anecdotal and inaccurate.
Fems tend to be passive aggressive in communication, butches declarative (final word kinds of statements). Fems make observations, like "it's cold in here," Butches ask for what they want, "would you make me a sandwich?" Fems sigh, roll their eyes and leave the room, butches feel relieved and let it drop, fems bring it up again later (bedtime). Detect a bias? Well...

I'm sure I'll think of more.

minniesota's picture

I don't know exactly what I

I don't know exactly what I think about this issue of communication styles because I'm too distracted by the thought of something else having to do with the tongue.

From Mars,
~Minnie

Still searching for the right brainy quote.